Curse

Black Kenpachi · Nov 10, 2007, 09:48 PM // 21:48

Why do people say that W/Mo with healing prayers is a bad thing. It's way better than using Healing Signet. I mean look at Healing Breeze. Health Regen and it cast faster than Healing Signet. So is Vigorous Spirit. Even in pvp I still think Healing Prayers beats Healing Signet. The most used ones for a warrior in Healing Prayers is faster and if you have bad energy management then go with Vigorous Spirit.

karunpav · Nov 10, 2007, 10:00 PM // 22:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

Why do people say that W/Mo with healing prayers is a bad thing.

Because it's not efficient for energy and it requires you to spec into another attribute just for a heal, while if you go for Tactics (if you even use a self heal), you can actually get stuff out of it (a shield, for example).

Quote:

It's way better than using Healing Signet.

It's really not.

Quote:

I mean look at Healing Breeze. Health Regen and it cast faster than Healing Signet.

Exactly. It's health regen. Usually when you need to heal, you need it right away. You don't want to have to wait. It also costs 10 energy and a heavy spec to get the minimal heal it provides. AND it can be removed since it's an enchantment.

Quote:

So is Vigorous Spirit.

Which requires you to attack and, since you should only be healing yourself if you're close to death and you shouldn't be attacking if you're dying, Vigorous Spirit makes no sense. And it's an enchantment and requires an outside spec, so it fails on those accounts as well.

Quote:

Even in pvp I still think Healing Prayers beats Healing Signet. The most used ones for a warrior in Healing Prayers is faster and if you have bad energy management then go with Vigorous Spirit.

You barely see anyone using a self heal in PvP anyways. And even then, Healing Signet heals for more with a better attribute spread, can't be removed, and you don't have to wait for it. If you're wasting your energy on healing yourself, then you need to get better monks.

martialis · Nov 10, 2007, 10:12 PM // 22:12

Because a monk with 14 healing prayers and good spells is better than a wammo with 8 healing prayers and healing breeze. Because it doesn't matter how strong you are if you have no energy. Because people care more about being cool than being competent or honest. What the hell does healing signet have to do with anything? Which answer do you want to hear?

Of course healing prayers are better than healing signet - that's why people play monks. Please tell me how play wammo right, without bad energy management.

Burst Cancel · Nov 10, 2007, 10:21 PM // 22:21

Attn: Stormlord Alex,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex

What can I say? I'm a hardcore Warrior and masochist

They're not usually this bad though... Q&A dumped it on me >.>

You were saying? -_-

MBP · Nov 10, 2007, 10:24 PM // 22:24

wammos were really only effective in some areas of prophecies where there is no heavy enchantment removal

and the build is basically
[skill]penetrating blow[/skill][skill]dismember[/skill] [skill]executioner's strike[/skill] or [skill]agonizing chop[/skill]
for sword [skill]sever artery[/skill][skill]gash[/skill][skill]galrath slash[/skill]
plus
[skill]dolyak signet[/skill][skill]healing breeze[/skill][skill]healing hands[/skill][skill]mending[/skill] and res

using radiant insignias should give you enough energy, you could probably toss dolyak signet for a ias. you could probably dump the res too for party buff like [skill]"watch yourself!"[/skill]

It really doesn't work in the other campaigns where there is enchantment striping galore, especially in nightfall where everything hates the dervish with utmost intensity.

If you're gonna be wammo save it for prophecies

In all honesty though leaving the healing to the monks so you can save your skill bar for pumping out more damage is the better way to go

yum · Nov 10, 2007, 10:33 PM // 22:33

Since the op mentioned pvp, you can assume that I flame the above post badly.

**Marty Silverblade** · Nov 10, 2007, 10:40 PM // 22:40

Hmm, how to say this nicely: W/Mo's with Healing Prayers suck really hard mate.

-You're wasting ~50 attribute points.
-They're strippable.
-Get Monks that don't fail.
-You have 2 perfectly acceptable heals, one in Str and one in Tactics, both of which allow full use of a shield (don't have to drop a line to make Healing Prayers ~8)
-It's simply not as effective as Warrior selfheals and [skill=text]"Watch Yourself!"[/skill]
-It hampers you ability to pwn nub AI.
-There's no need to spend 2-3 slots on something 1 slot can do.
-It's energy inefficient.

The only real pro is that the average PuG (i.e, random noobs), will think you're super pro and you'll pwn everything!!!!1!!one!!

8 good reasons for Warrior heals > Wammo heals.

EDIT: A list of all the Monk skills that should ever touch a Warrior's bar:

[card]Mending Touch[/card][card]Succor[/card][card]Rebirth[/card][card]Resurrection Chant[/card][card]Purge Signet[/card][card]Holy Veil[/card]. You'll only need Rebirth in PuGs, where wipes happen really often, and you'll only need PS and HV if you're Monks still suck.

iridescentfyre · Nov 10, 2007, 11:24 PM // 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

Why do people say that W/Mo with healing prayers is a bad thing. It's way better than using Healing Signet. I mean look at Healing Breeze. Health Regen and it cast faster than Healing Signet. So is Vigorous Spirit. Even in pvp I still think Healing Prayers beats Healing Signet. The most used ones for a warrior in Healing Prayers is faster and if you have bad energy management then go with Vigorous Spirit.

Because it is a waste. Exactly how much do you think you need to be able to heal yourself? What about "Watch Yourself!" "Shields Up!" and "Save Yourselves!", defenses that actually help your group? You have a monk to heal you, if you truly must have a self-heal, bring Healing Signet. Which leads me to another point...

...Healing Breeze is garbage compared to Healing Signet. Assuming 8 Healing Prayers, you have +7 regen with Breeze. That's 14 points of health gained per second. At a paltry 8 Tactics, Healing Signet heals you for 100. It would take you 7 seconds to gain that much with Breeze. If you need a heal, 7 seconds means death. Hell, 3 seconds means death. If you take into account that the only time you should ever have to heal yourself is in an extreme emergency, having to wait 2 seconds instead of 7 for a heal isn't such a bad deal anymore. On top of that, most of us run more than 8 Tactics anyway, and 8 Healing Prayers is laughably high for a Warrior.

Anyway, a W/Mo with healing prayers is a low-DPS self-heal machine that offers comparatively little to a group in either PvE or PvP.

Master Ketsu · Nov 10, 2007, 11:28 PM // 23:28

Simple:

Warrior with decent damage build + a monk with decent healing build >>>>>>>>> 2 wammos.

dont feel no pain · Nov 10, 2007, 11:42 PM // 23:42

Wammo's home = Pve
Wammo's go visit = Ab/Ra
Wammo's banned from = Ha

the rest... well thats a line that gets crossed to much.

Black Kenpachi · Nov 11, 2007, 12:03 AM // 00:03

Well then can someone tell me if this build is good for a PvE Wammo in general? BTW I only have Proph and Factions.

Strength 8+1 Rune
Tactics 10+1 Rune
Swordsmanship 12+3 Rune +1 Helm

Sun and Moon Slash
SliverWing Slash
Galrath Slash
Dragon Slash
Dolyak Sig
Watch Yourself
Heal Sig
Ressurect

Then for PvP:

Strength 8+1 Rune
Swordsmanship 12+3 Rune +1 Helm
Smiting Prayers 10

Sever Artery
Gash
Sun and Moon Slash
Frenzy
Bull's Charge
Strength Of Honor
Purge Sig or Holy Veil
Rez Sig

Arkantos · Nov 11, 2007, 01:16 AM // 01:16

Healing prayers on a warrior is bad because you're using useful attribute points for crap spells. All a warrior needs is healing signet. Monks are in the party for a reason. Now I'm not saying you can go aggro 5 mobs and expect the monk to keep you alive, but if you aggro 1 or 2 groups and you dont act like a retard, all you'll need is a monk.

Ressurect is a pretty bad res, I'd go with res sig or sunspear rebirth sig. As for your PvP build, it's crap. You have no self heal and you're wasting attribute points on an enchantment that isn't that great and can be removed. Also a sup rune in PvP is bad.

Winterclaw · Nov 11, 2007, 01:59 AM // 01:59

The only time you should really invest in HP as a warrior is if you are farming somewhere specific. An example of this is troll farming in NM back in proph. In theory you could use WoH now as a self heal, but that'd be a waste of an elite most of the time.

Note in VS's defense even though it isn't a great skill, as a warrior you should be attacking and it could help reduce the damage coming in a little. However a monk using VS on you would give you more HP per attack and if you need to heal yourself, use heal sig because you should have points in tactics anyways. A hybrid monk might consider bringing it as a cover enchant because of its quick cast time or as a prelude to DK, but that discussion belongs in the monk boards.

iridescentfyre · Nov 11, 2007, 02:00 AM // 02:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

Well then can someone tell me if this build is good for a PvE Wammo in general? BTW I only have Proph and Factions.

Strength 8+1 Rune
Tactics 10+1 Rune
Swordsmanship 12+3 Rune +1 Helm

Sun and Moon Slash
SliverWing Slash
Galrath Slash
Dragon Slash
Dolyak Sig
Watch Yourself
Heal Sig
Ressurect

Resurrect is the only res skill without a single redeeming quality. I would go with Res Signet, Resurrection Chant (with low healing prayers!!), or Flesh Of My Flesh. Nearly anything goes in PvE, but rezzing your party members with only 25% health and no energy is not one of them. You're in the right mindset to use /Mo secondary for a hard res, though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

Then for PvP:

Strength 8+1 Rune
Swordsmanship 12+3 Rune +1 Helm
Smiting Prayers 10

Sever Artery
Gash
Sun and Moon Slash
Frenzy
Bull's Charge
Strength Of Honor
Purge Sig or Holy Veil
Rez Sig

The extra damage from Strength of Honor doesn't justify 10 Smiting Prayers. Replacing it with Final Thrust (or even just Galrath Slash) will increase your damage way more and free up those attributes on top of it.

Exhonour · Nov 11, 2007, 02:21 AM // 02:21

well i use shadow refuge on sin as secondary instead of healing breeze, i am not judged

Black Kenpachi · Nov 11, 2007, 03:24 AM // 03:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

Also a sup rune in PvP is bad.

How is a sup rune in PvP bad? In PvP warrior's are supposed to be killing with the highest damage possible. Thats's why frenzy is the best IAS in PvP.

iridescentfyre · Nov 11, 2007, 03:37 AM // 03:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

How is a sup rune in PvP bad? In PvP warrior's are supposed to be killing with the highest damage possible. Thats's why frenzy is the best IAS in PvP.

The numbers will show that from 14 Axe Mastery (12+1+1) to 16 (12+1+3), the damage difference is negligible. However in a PvP setting, +75 hp is not negligible.

Legendary Shiz · Nov 11, 2007, 04:06 AM // 04:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

Even in pvp I still think Healing Prayers beats Healing Signet.

Do everyone a favor, and keep your demon child Wammo away from PvP.

Arkantos · Nov 11, 2007, 05:06 AM // 05:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Black Kenpachi

How is a sup rune in PvP bad? In PvP warrior's are supposed to be killing with the highest damage possible. Thats's why frenzy is the best IAS in PvP.

First of all, the difference in damage between 16 weapon mastery and 14 weapon mastery isn't that great, and it's been proven. With -75hp and dp, you'll have a very low amount of health and you'll be an easy target. 14 weapon mastery + save 75 health > 16 weapon mastery + lose 75 health.

Black Kenpachi · Nov 11, 2007, 06:32 AM // 06:32

Thanks for the info. I completely realized how many flaws I had.